the session, and we're well off that. stick around, more to come including james grant on everything in this economy right now. more of "closing bell" with maria bartiromo. >> it is 4:00 on wall street, do you know where your money is? we're following at the close tonight. it was close but no si cigar after falling more than 100 points. in the end, the bears were out. the dow looking to finish down about 30 points right here. the dow and s&p 500 down for six straight sessions. and jamie dimon's house front and center. all eyes on jpmorgan chase as investors are awaiting news on clawbacks. and it's what some are calling for, but will clawbacks have

unintended consequences that will impact the bottom line. we have it covered straight ahead "closing bell." how are we settling down? dow industrials are down a quarter of a percent. volume on the light side. the nasdaq gave up 21.75. a sea of red, and red is what we will see for the first week of july if this streak continues. westwood holdings mark freeman says the focus should be on fundamentals. colorfulty on europe and other issues is not coming soon. we also have jeff cox. thank you for being on the program and joining us. >> great to be with you. >> mark, you're expecting pretty tough markets? >> look, i think as you lie

highlighted several times, especially on the macro front, they're waiting for resolution on the european debt crisis, the fiscal cliff, or waiting for higher rates. they're waiting for things that will not be resolved in the near term. it's creating a lot of frustration. >> ben, you need a strategy for the short-term and for the long term. how do you trade this market? >> u think we will be choppy no doubt. one of the other things we're waiting for is more monetary easing. and i think there is disappointment there. don't know whether we get that this summer. so i think we're still looking at choppy markets. we're still, basically, equal weight equities. we're starting to move into commodities a little more. it has been hit harder than equities so there might be opportunities there. we still think we grind higher by the end of the year and that

will not start happening until the pal. >> let's talk about earnings. we're about to learn what jpmorgan will report, what are you expecting? >> not much. let's talk about sentiment. the american association of american investors, the bullish sentiment in the market is 30%. that's lou the historical average of 39%. why is that important? why do we care? it's been that way for 15 consecutive weeks. that has not happened since 1993. one other data set to throw at you, in-flows to the global equities so far this year, $1 billion to global bond funs this year, $130 billion. it is trading at the widest discount of bonds that we have

seen in the history of our data. going back to the original question about earnings, a lot of pessimism, looks like a buyers strike in the market. >> mark, what do you want to do here then? you have to put money to work, being a portfolio manager and running money, how do you trade and invest for the long term? >> that's a great question, and that's what we're all wrestling with in this environment. especially if you have an environment defined by low gdp and negative interest rates. investors up to this point have been going after what one would expect is most valued and that's growth in income. they have been going at it as an either/or proposition. what i think is most attractive in the short run and especially in the long run is those securities that offer a combination of both. i think it adds a little income

and a little growth, and that's a very attractive profile. i would not ignore other asset classes or the rest of the capital structure also. i opportunities are there, but it will take work in terms of finding those, be they're there. >> maria, i don't think anybody is thinking long term right now. if you look at the last hour of trading, eight of the nine sessions prior to trading the market was up. this is just traders in this market here, nobody in for long term. >> for sure, thank you very much, we'll see you soon. >> a late day rebound loses steam, we have bob on the floor of the nyse right now. >> we were down 110 points, things improved, and we were up briefly. the dow down six straight days. look at the major gainers, health care stocks and kwon

assumer staple stocks moving up. proctor and gamble had a great day here today. we're not sure how much he is investing here, but it's substantial. he says the company is under valued and that was big volume today. that helped the dow jones, but what do we need? tech stocks moving up, all of them lagged today. home builders, well known analyst commented about pricing trends and those stocks went up. i just got back from italy, the euro was at a two-year low. it was $1.26 yesterday, it is $1.22 today. a four cent move in a week. coming up, big focus on big

banks, jpmorgan and wells far go set to postearnings, but the real news could be the jpmorgan clawbacks and the impact of their trading losses. how will it affect how the banks do business. warren buffet telling cnbc the fed is the out of bullets. jim grant weighs in on that. plus, cleaning house, a new wave of foreclosures is on the way. could this be just the thing the downtrodden housing sector needs to get back on track? that's all ahead. ld be like --

welcome back, jpmorgan kicks off bank earnings in the morning, and the focus will be on what jamie dimon does to restore confidence. a size mlarge shift could happe

executive pay. could the clawbacks have unintended consequences? one of our guests, and the other says it's better to play it safe. gentleman, good to have you on the program, thank you for joining us. antoine, you think there is a risk in these clawbacks, why? >> it's all about risk taking. it's always about risk verses return, and the same compensation restructure rings true for lenders and traders. making the bank money verses not doing business at all. i think the real way to deal with bank risk, and they have done a good job of it, is putting more capital on bank sheets. they should notbe stopped from taking a risk.

you will deal with company tigs much better. so there is no doubt you can improve profitability by reducing pay, but i think you have to encourage risk taking. that's one of the problems. more risk taking taking place in the economy, and you need money to flow. >> that's a good point. matt, you say it's better safe than sorry here. >> yes, i like companies that don't have clawback provisions because they're doing something that could blow up. you look at positions here with claw backs and it's yet to be defined. when you look at it, it's not a deterrent to stopping future trades. you have to have some risk, and if someone makes a mistake, however, every single one of the traders on the street thinks they're smarter than the other guy. they think it won't happen to them, maria, so it's not going to stop future trading patterns,

and if it does, people just take the hit and they move on and say we'll come up with another way to do it. i respectfully disagree. capital ratios are not the answer. you could have the highest case you want and still go out. you news prudence in this case, and jpmorgan could have had a better day and a better trading issue. >> you're supposed to be getting paid for taking risks. they took risks and they had a huge mistake, and it was too much risk, but what about the point that, you know, they're going to be gun shy and not taking risk if they're afraid they're compensation is going to get impacted. >> i think the real test will be how management reacts. if they come down and hits the hammer and applies a huge clawback to a tier one employee like jamie dimon, traders on the street are going to be hey, i have to watch out, and they will

be more gun shy. banks are not making money on lending any more because spreads are anemic. if that gets curtailed, and that's wrong, where will the earnings growth come from and these shares will be impacted. >> let's talk about earnings getting impacted antoine. do you own jpmorgan? what are you expected? >> we own less than we used to own. i do expect they will give us clarity on the size of the loss. the rumors have been out there everywhere. every publication posted an estimated loss. i think getting it behind us will be important for the shares. i think it's important to look through and say here is the loss, how much did they really earn, what are they capable of earning, and if they take risk will it impact their earnings going forward. the stock is cheap, but i'm concerned about the libor

issues. >> a lot of banks are involved, do you think this gets bigger? >> it has to, there's too many players involved, it's a political football. they had fun with it in london. they have not done anything with it yet. jpmorgan and bank of america were all involved. there will be plenty of attorneys crying foul. so there is a case out there and a big number. and it's a burden of proof, but look at the mortgage mess. and what did that britisaccompl? >> what do you want to be owning going into this earnings period for the banks? >> you want to own strong mortgage platforms, jpmorgan,

wells fargo, some of the big regional banks will show very strong mortgage numbers. >> and matt, in terms of the regulatory environment, there's so much uncertainty and lack of clarity in terms of, antoine mens the regulatory and the rate setting scandal -- >> this industry can't buy a break. you have europe that's a mess, you have lib oh , r picking up and getting worse. you have the regulatory front that is difficult and getting worse. you the economy that's slowing and political issues heating up here. i say you avoid european banks. look at reits and regional plays. focus on high quality dividend stocks. when you look at the issues of the banks, there's no easy answers and they will only get

worse. you don't have to own them going into an increasingly volatile network. you have to have a strong stomach and understand it will be volatile. >> thank you, gentleman, we'll be watching the bank stocks and the earnings period. we want to hear from our audience. do you think jpmorgan should claw back salary from jamie dimon himself? we'll put your answers on the show later in the program. jim grant who founded the widely red newsletter will be with me for a one-on-one next. stay with us for jim grant. and another blow to taxpayers, student loan defaults could add up to the hundreds of millions. tdd# 1-800-345-2550 i'm constantly working my screens.

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a negative yield, 15 years peel are willing to put their money out at a minus rate in real terms. that's about as far as you can go. >> buffett says the fed is out of bullets. jim grant joins me now exclusively with the reaction. good to have you on the program. we have talked about these below zero interest rates for a long time, what's your take on what buffett just said? >> the fed is not out of bullets, the problem is that the gun shoots back wards. these massive interventions distort the price we call interest rates. they fiked libor, the banks fixed it, the fed fixes rates, the banks do this optimisticly. the fed does it for a living. they have operation twist, it has operation qe by which it manipulates bond yields.

it has the portfolio balance effect, very elegant phrase. you know what we're living in? have you seen the truman show where jim carey finds out he's living on a reality show. he finds out because he rows his boat into a painted canvas sky. that is like life. the idea that these guys talking about what they might finance their bank account at is absurd, the central banks do it all the time. the outrage ought to be directly with them. >> this is a good angle to take. we're surprised you this rate rigging scandal, and the federal reserve has been manipulating the market with all this free money. >> the market, the yield curve, and expectations. >> what about this libor scandal

a lot of people think it's going to get bigger. >> it might, but i say our outrage ought to be redirected at the people that won't leave prices alone. they're all in it, they all do the same thing. so what do people do? what do investors want now. what they increasingly seem to want is nothing. there is a huge pull market in what is safety, government obligations priced at zero or less than zero. take the swiss frank. the skisz central bank printed up $50 odd billion a month in order to manipulate the exchange rate of the swiss frank, and people are willing to accept less than zero in that currency. >> you wrote a cartoon about this. i want to show this.

the central bank, but market manipulation is many job! >> i think that's chairman bernanke speaking from within the fed. we caught that with our espionage efforts. >> they are creating the yield curve as you said, and once again the banks are the bad dies. >> it's not yet big enough. that's the trouble as i see it. >> we're helping you here, trying to get that out. in terms of your feelings about the fed, i recognize that you're calling it manipulation, but that doesn't mean it's not going to stop, right? people are now expecting operation twist, are you expecting it? >> qe 3, yes. >> there's no reason why they wouldn't. they are in the business of manipulating or trying to

markets, a macro economy, interest rates, unemployment, inflation, through various monetary needs including the twisting of yield curves and interest rates. >> has it helped europe? i mean, you know, the euro zone is still in a funk. the headlines are driving markets everywhere. but a lot of people feel the ecb did do a good job with the rto fund. >> it created immense amounts of euros with which the banks could fore stall the losses. the trouble with europe is they work five hours a day. it has nothing to do with a shortage of euros. everyone is talking about the perfect storm, the fiscal cliff, china, greece, europe. there is a constellation of bad news. how can this be a perfect storm if we see it coming, right?

isn't what makes it perfect is the surprise. >> it looks like we're setting ourselves up for the same kind of nail biter with this fiscal cliff. >> it does, but about six weeks ago, the ft ran to me one of the clarifying headlines of the cycle on page one. it was "death of equities?" there was a question mark after it. bond yields are less than nothing, people don't want stocks, it's not impossible for something that's going to surprise us to the up side, sfligt i. >> you know what you do? you plant black walnut trees, and in 30 years, they flower at

$1000 each. jim grant joining us, editor of grant interest rate observer. forget paying for your kids college, you may be paying for college of kids you don't know. and $200 million of customer funds missing, a ceo recovered from a suicide attempt, and we'll have the latest developments on this financial scandal. and do you think jpmorgan board should claw back salary from jamie dimon? send us a twee tweet @cnbcclosingbell. empires. then, some said, we lost our edge. well today, there's a new new york state. one that's working to attract businesses and create jobs.

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welcome back, you think government bailouts are over? it the government controlling the student loan market, they may soon be on the hook. we may see a tsunami of student loan defaults through 2020 saying the industry under

estimated them by $220 million. one of our guests say the government should never have gotten into this in the first place, and the other says the government had to get involved. peter, good to have you on the program, thank you for joining us, why is it a bad idea? >> just like the government inflated a housing bubble, the reason tuitions are so high, is because governments guarantee the loans. take the government out of the equation and the colleges and universities have to lower tuitions so students can atord ford to go, but the beneficiaries are not the students, it's the colleges and universities that can sell overpriced degrees. we have a lot of people with college degrees waiting tables, cleani

cleaning toilets, and they have enormous debt to pay back. >> diana, you're saying the government has to be involved, why? >> investment in human capital is never a waste of money. human capital should never be sacrificed. and i completely agree that college graduates today, especially young college graduates have been hard hit by the recession that they never predicted, and it's not fair to ask them to shoulder the burden alone. their wages have fallen by 15%, and their debt has risen 25%, and it's unaccept tobl suggest that every college student does not have the right to go to school. they should all have the opportunity to pursue an education. >> barclays saying we will see a tsunami of student loan debt

here. >> we need to all agree that session a social good and we'll all be better off. he need to invest in our future and the economy and the economy is the big problem. there aren't enough jobs being created for college grads so they are driving buss and are hair tilist and that's a big problem. they're squeezing young noncollege grads out of those jobs and taking a pay cut that can't pay for their debt. and the problem is having a low growth economy. the only way out of this is to educate kids and get them into jobs that are peter paid. >> let me get a word in here because wasting money, overpaying for worthless degree social security not going to help the economy. >> no degree is worthless. you're always acquiring skills. >> no. >> it's whether or not the jobs are there. >> a lot of the curriculum and courses do very little to improve human capital. plenty of people went to college before the government got

involved. it didn't cost nearly as much. people didn't graduate with a mortgage. >> i don't think colleges are setting prices based on how much students can take out of banks. >> no, they're bases their prices based on the fact that students can borrow money with government guarantees. >> i think there's more to it than that. >> it is. >> i disagree. >> students couldn't borrow money so cheaply, interest rates would rise. >> so when you get to decide who gets to go to cge only rich students get to go. that's a very good message to send. >> it's not up to the government to pay for everybody's college degree. you don't have a right to go to college. >> i think everybody should have the opportunity to go to college, and you should not decide. >> i'm not deciding it, but by subsidizing it they created this huge bubble. do you think students are better off? i have had plenty of students, their biggest regret is they

went to college because now they have a enormous debt. >> they're stuck with a bad economy that's not creating jobs. >> the reason for that is the government is diverting all of the capitol to education. >> of all of the things the government is spending money on, i would hardly suggest that human capital -- i would be hard pressed to suggest that investing in a college session a bad investment. >> it's a lousy investment. >> it's never a lousy investment and when that's the case we have a real problem on our hands because the only way to invest in our future is through education. >> not everybody needs a college degree. what you're doing is playing into the university and colleges -- they want to exploit our kids. >> i'm saying everybody that wants to go should get to go. >> the question is who is paying for it? >> ultimately -- >> our taxes are on the hook her. >> with entitlement programs and the housing sector, all of the things the taxpayers would be on

the hook for, i argue that education is one of the least controversial. >> it's very controversial, and a college degree is not worth the price you pay for it. >> i agree, that's a big problem. >> if we simply got the government out of education, college tuitions would plunge. colleges would be forced to compete. >> i don't gagree with that. i'm well aware of basic economics. >> apparently you're not. >> yes, i am. thank you. i would argue there is a lot more variables at play with a college -- >> it's prices are determines by supply and demand. if you take away the demand by taking away the guaranteed loans, colleges will have to stop building fancy gyms and fancy off campus housing or the big restaurants. they will have to cut prices, cut the pay of some of their -- >> they'll have to cut the

faculty, technology, investment, absolutely. >> no. the technology will increase. in the 1950s, students got great educations in college and it didn't cost anything. kids used to woerk their way through college and they graduated debt free. >> and there were jobs from them. >> we're going to agree to disagree, these are all very good points. great conversation. laying it all out for us, thank you. meanwhile, we revealed right here on tuesday that texas is the top state for business in our exclusive study. what state did cnbc users and twitter followers pick as their top state, and we have a winner, iowa, thanks to everybody who voted. iowa did pretty well in the official top state studies as well. it placed 12th overall for best states to do business in. is this a good sign for the

housing market? next, we'll break down realty tracks latest report for you. and two gurus will square off. and mitt romney coming under fire for drawing a lot of campaign contributions from the financial industry? really? where else would these folks throw their money? my observation coming up. you're watching the closing bell, first in business worldwide. m not have thought of -- fidelity. now you don't have to go to a bank to get the things you want from a bank, like no-fee atms, all over the world. free checkwriting and mobile deposits. now depositing a check is as easy as taking a picture. free online bill payments. a highly acclaimed credit card with 2% cash back into your fidelity account. open a fidelity cash management account today and discover another reason serious investors are choosing fidelity. mine was earned off vietnam in 1968. over the south pacific in 1943.

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welcome back, a mixed picture, filings were down 11% in the first half of the year. there are signs that foreclosures may start climbing again this fall. diana has the latest. >> that's right, the overall numbers are county because banks are repossessing less homes. with the big banks and the state attorney general over robo signing. new foreclosures are up while they get delinquent loans into the pipeline. the first jump in quarterly starts since twine before the robo signing scandal. now that the settlement is in place, the banks are churning through these loans. an 18% jump in california catapulted that state to the top

foreclosure state. this new wave of foreclosures may turn around those home price gains we have seen recently. it eased the number of borrows in an equity position. down from $12.1 million in q 4. still, those homeowners cannot move because of that negative equity position and they cannot make advantage of the record low interest rates. a new record, freddy mac telling us 3.56 on the 30-year fixed. incredible. >> thanks. more foreclosures seems like bad news, but dan says foreclosures clears out the market and it's a positive. but fred does not see that silver lining. dan, great to have you on the program, make the case. >> thank you. the idea is simple here.

millions of americans are severely delinquent. they have to go through foreclosure. there's other options that are not very good. one is mortgage modifications. these tend to default. the other options for banks to slowly release these over a decade or something and create a stagnant market for that period. then it can rise and appreciate at a historical rate. >> fred, you disagree, there is a negative to rising foreclos e foreclosur foreclosures? >> yes, the people who are able to get mortgages have a harder time. now you have this foreclosure on the books at a certain area, and a fore cloeer is says this house is only worth $100,000 and you're trying to buy it for 250. there are solutions though.

fannie and freddy have to take into account these foe closures and remove them from new apraise -- appraisals. there's no record of what exact price was. those kind of things will help. feel get depressed when you see an area that's worse and worse and worse. less people will buy there and the values will plummet. i understand dan's point, and it's just a macro and a micro, and we just have to make the ideas work. >> doesn't the kofd of homeowners get shaken with this foreclosure activity if they want to sell their house? >> sure, but i think if we have a stagnant unhealthy economy for a long time, is that better than

pulling the band aid off quickly? just modestly letting that inventory work itself out and then you have a normal market again. >> could one argument that if the banks are comfortable moving forward with foreclosures, that they feel the market is improving, enough to get rid of some of the investory. >> and let's get the short-sales done in 30 days instead of six months and the banks will be whole. and the biggest part, is the harp program was fantastic, but the banks have ruined it by lowering the loan values to 105, being really picky about things. do what president said to do. no matter what the value, loan the money to the people that qualify with good credit and

income and they will stay in the properties, and if there is less foreclosures, there is less of these problems. >> what would your charterization of housing be right now? >> on a micro basis, there are some areas that are fantastic and some areas that are terrible, and you just to to pick the location you want to be in and buy the right area. you have to go out and get a feeling. but some places are just terrible. we talked about it on the show before. we might have to knock down 1,000 houses and move people. but that's just the way it is. >> fred, how do you get a foreclosure, people want to know that. >> they go on some websites and see these addresses and call me and say i want to buy this house, it's a foreclosure when it isn't. the banks go to the sale, depending on the state, the banks buy it back and give it to

a real estate agent to sell. when it comes on the market that's when you can buy it. there's no secret list of bank held assets like 40 years ago. you can go to the sheriff sales, but usually what happens is the bank owes so much money you can't buy it at the sheriff's sale, so you have to wait. >> thank you, we'll see you soon, appreciate your time tonight. we'll take a break, and then what will move your money first thing tomorrow morning? three of wall street's smartest strategists will join me, and scott cohn on the latest with a financial scandal rocking iowa. and i will talk to eliot spitzer,ly ask him about the recent charge that's his prosecution against the former boss was based on personal animosity. that's tomorrow, stay with us.

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welcome back. it's another financial collapse that's dprauing outrage from lawmakers and investors. filed for chapter 7 bankruptcy protection after regulators say $200 million in customer funds were unaccounted for.

on top of all of this, the founder remains in a hospital following a suicide attempt. earlier this week, scott cohn has the latest developments in cedar falls, iowa. we got word the cftc is calling an march meemergency meeting ine of this. >> reporter: there are some issues here that they need to address. so, yes, the cftc is going to hold an emergency meeting later this month to talk about what issues this exposes here at pfg. we also can confirm that the founder of pfg best is now in the psychiatric unit at a hospital in iowa city, iowa, at university of iowa. just a shocking turn of events over the last week. this is an economic development pamphlet or book, i should say, that was put together by the local of chamber of commerce not too long ago, which has him in it. he's a prominent person in this community, talking about moving pfg back to iowa and hundreds of

employees from the chicago headquarters just three years ago, betting on the quality of life here. so when the call came in to the sheriff's department that there was a suicide attempt, initially chair tony thompson thought it was routine. >> my chief deputy walked in and said, hey, you know that guy that tried to kill himself over there at pfg? that was russ. i just thawing, oh, no. >> reporter: and it turns out that when deputies got on to the scene, they saw there was a note in the car where russ tried to kill himself. that note spoke to accounting problems at the company. sheriff thompson immediately called in the fbi and everything has gone on from there. as they continue to try and unfold this, we also reported earlier today that russell's son had sent an e-mail to employees the friday before the monday suicide attempt basically saying that everything was okay. clearly, that's not the case.

maria. >> what a story, scott. thanks very much. we'll keep following your reporting on this. scott cohn tonight live. let's get more with tomorrow's action. what we want to look forward to. 30 seconds on the clock. our next guests will tell us what they think will move the markets. joining us now, steven bookbar, kevin karen, and rob smally. peter, what are you watching for tomorrow? >> tomorrow's focus begins tonight when china reports their very important gdp number retail sales. retail sales at 7.7% will be the weakest since the first quarter in 2009. industrial production up less than 10% for the third straight month for the first time also since early 2009. >> all right. we got some good things to look at. kevin, you're up. 30 seconds on the clock. >> we got bank earnings tomorrow. we'll look at jpmorgan. we'll also get consumer confidence. keep an eye on that. you'll get a speech from dennis

lockhart. typically a mod cat gerate guy. to not a fan of qe-3. >> we'll be watching. rob, over to you with 30 seconds on the clock. >> bank earnings are the focus tomorrow as they kick off. jpmorgan is the focus. they've added half an hour to its analyst call to talk about its london whale cio derivatives trade. jamie dimon will have to be convincing they've cleaned it up and know the size of the ultimate losses. i'll be looking at the buy back program. a resumption to that would be positive. >> all right. we'll be watching as well. thank you, gentlemen. we appreciate you chiming in. up next, my observation on the heat mitt romney is taking about campaign contributions from the financial industry. back in a moment. people with a machine.ced what ? customers didn't like it.

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not a coincidence. that's the same group president obama has been vilifying for more than four years. so instead of that statistic being so surprising, what caught my eye was how many wall streeters are fundraising for the president. check this out. 15% of mr. obama's bundlers are from the money world. that's not as many as romney, but not a small number either. the president has raised millions upon millions here in new york city with the elite. most of the fundraisers are attended by folks in the financial world. the point is, there is nothing wrong with wall streeters fundraising for either candidate. it's not somehow nefarious when they do it for governor romney and pure when they do it for the president. it simply is what it is. wall street is not all republican, and it's not all democrat. the fact is, any candidate running for the ultimate office needs wall street's financial support. it's like what john dillenger said when he robs banks.

that's where the money is. we asked you, do you think jpmorgan's board should claw back salary from jamie dimon? it looks like a split division on twitterville. chad says, absolutely, lead by example. ill will says, no way. they still turned a nice profit and are on top of things. plus, the man has a great haircut. matt is on the other side. if dimon wants to restore faith in his company, he should be a leader. leave blame game to the fed. kevin tweets, as a shareholder i say no. thanks, everybody, for tweeting in. we appreciate your comments. before we look at the day on wall street, things did worsen at close. dow dropped about 31 points. certainly off of the worst levels, anyway. 12,573 is where the industrial average settled out. nasdaq gave up 21 points. technology laggered once again. the s&p 500 down 6 1/2 points. that wil d